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 Post subject: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 11:15 am 
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I find the number of people jumping on the global warming sceptic bandwagon quite depressing - just because it is uncomfortable, expensive and worrying, the great majority will find any excuse to not have to believe it. Yes certain scientists have committed PR own goals, but that doesn't detract from the scientific consensus. I'm fed up with having to listen to 'huh, if this is global warming, why's it snowing. Ha ha' comments in the office. So this might be of interest: http://timesonline.typepad.com/science/ ... -cold.html

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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 11:32 am 
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..and have you read the comments below the article!

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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 11:42 am 
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Yes, which I think proves my point - find individual reports / articles that contradict the consensus and use these as ammunition, without considering the big picture. I'm not surprised there is a big swing towards scepticism. It's just depressing. What next: the Greenland ice cap isn't really accelerating into meltdown, the North Pole sea ice isn't disappearing, it's all a big cover up? Of course it is an unexact science, and errors will be made.

The only argument is how much of it is anthropogenic and most of the research points to a significant contribution from man. Mind you, it's all academic cos nothing effective will ever get done, and we'll find out eventually who was right by default. Quite an interesting, high stakes gamble that...

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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 12:25 pm 
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I am still in the sceptic camp, my argument is simply this, The world changes, maybe the ice caps will melt completely in the next 100 years and in 200 years time they reapear.
99.9% of all species that have ever lived have died out, to me that suggests change.


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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:39 pm 
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Hi Steve,

Undisputably (unless one is a creationist!) the world changes: continents move, climate changes. The problem at the moment is the rate of change, far greater than at any time in recorded history and possibly than at any time in prehistory that can be accurately measured (although I'm sure the asteroid that (probably) hit the earth at the end of the Mesozoic brought about some pretty rapid change!); extinctions are occurring at a greater rate than ever before, which looks like accelerating.

I think it is very easy for people to be sceptical, because it supports a do-nothing approach, stops one from having to think about the consequences, both for the individual and for society; it is what the majority of the world's population, especially in the western world, would like to hear. It easy to be sceptical because a sceptic will always be right in arguing that it is all in the future, depends on computer models, and requires the interpretation of data that most of us do not have the training or knowledge to understand. Do I fully understand the science? No, at least not more than 10% of it fully. But I can read and listen to the arguments from both sides, and until someone makes a cogent case for global climate change NOT being man made, I would rather trust science, rather than the vested commercial and political interests of the sceptic agenda. I don't really understand the Big Bang, or how black holes work; I haven't seen evolution happen before my own eyes - but I trust the scientists who do to be performing robust science so I don't end up thinking I was created by an omnipotent being from his rib, or whatever.

That's the thing about science rather than belief: you create a workable theory but should never be afraid to throw it away if new evidence comes to light. I am far more sceptical about the reasons for scepticism - there are far more vested interests in the world who would love nothing more than for it to taken to be a myth than there are in the climate change pro-camp, although of course there will always be those who are interested in making career capital out of it: that's human nature unfortunately.

I just can't see what we lose even if we do act now and find out either it isn't as bad as all that - i.e. the science is, ultimately, flawed - or that there was nothing we could do about it because it was due to sun spots on Alpha Centauri or something, feng shui or bad karma. What is wrong with moving to a more sustainable way of life, finding alternatives to fossil fuels, consuming less power and resources? Yes it will cost us, personally and economically, in the short term but will the world end up being a worse place because of it? No, and we might just have ensured our species and the environment in general can live alongside each other far better than we've managed since the Industrial Revolution.

I don't expect I've convinced you but I hope that what I've written above makes some kind of sense. I would love for it not to be true: for my children to grow up in a world where, whatever else is in store for them, the consequences of global warming won't be something they have to worry about. But from where we stand at the moment, the lack of action and political will worries me.

Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:19 pm 
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funny you should raise this because yesterday I was looking up info on the current condition of the gulf stream and found this newspaper article from 2005:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/u ... 598464.ece

Interesting and scarey!

Yes, I do believe there is a certain amount of global warming caused by activities on earth, but I also believe that it is also part and parcel of the normal course of events for climatic changes around the world over time - but probably speeded up considerably.

Its a very complicated subject.

Linda

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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:46 pm 
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I wonder if people are sceptical because they have little faith in so called government experts, You only have to look at the swine flu mess to realise these people are not fallible.
I have read your comments Mike and find it hard to disagree with you, but, I feel the Human race is an unstoppable force it will continue to consume until nothing is left as has happened many times before, Easter Island is a good example, on a positive note there may one hope....Cold fusion and sea water, now thats got potential.


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 Post subject: Re: Climate scepticism
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:53 am 
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I think you are right Steve on both counts. However I could counter the swine flu example - and I've read that this virus really was touch and go with which way it could go and we just got lucky this time - with the ridiculous paranoia about the triple vaccine MMR, which has led to a resurgence in rubella and measles in children cos parents stopped getting kids vaccinated. All because of one researcher's poor work - who has just recently been struck off for unprofessionalism - which was picked up by the press (the manipulation of the public by ill-informed cynics with an agenda to stir up trouble).

Human population control is a taboo subject. War, famine and disease will probably help with that, it always has in the past!

M

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